(12 Nov 2020, 21:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]in either case you will never fully understand
One of the NLP presuppositions is that it's impossible to understand another person. Practitioners of various "eastern schools" spend decades in attempts to understand themselves and who they are. Discussions are still possible by using commonly and similarly understandable concepts, and any successful discussion is like a pin-ball machine with two or more players. Where you get the ball at the end is a joint effort 😊
(12 Nov 2020, 21:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]In either case you will never fully understand it until you feel love or taste an orange.
Absolutely correct. I usually say: "You either feel it or not". E.g. psychology and socionics defines 4 basic languages (8 in socionics, they also differentiate between extra- and introvert functions): feeling, sensing, logic and intuition. Any verbal or written discussion is a translation from one "language" to the logic. Written discussion loses the most in this translation. However, no discussion is possible without a common language.
(12 Nov 2020, 21:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]So to me femininity is a feeling and its something you have to experience yourself through your own perspective. Nothing I say with these words will make you finally once and for all "get" femininity on a conceptional level, because it will always fall short of the feeling.
Again, fully agree with each word! But did you notice, that in this thread I asked not about the femininity as a philosophical concept:
(12 Nov 2020, 20:59 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ]What is a stereotypical girly girl in your opinion?
That's different, don't you think?
(12 Nov 2020, 21:45 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ] (12 Nov 2020, 21:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]in either case you will never fully understand
One of the NLP presuppositions is that it's impossible to understand another person. Practitioners of various "eastern schools" spend decades in attempts to understand themselves and who they are. Discussions are still possible by using commonly and similarly understandable concepts, and any successful discussion is like a pin-ball machine with two or more players. Where you get the ball at the end is a joint effort 😊
(12 Nov 2020, 21:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]In either case you will never fully understand it until you feel love or taste an orange.
Absolutely correct. I usually say: "You either feel it or not". E.g. psychology and socionics defines 4 basic languages (8 in socionics, they also differentiate between extra- and introvert functions): feeling, sensing, logic and intuition. Any verbal or written discussion is a translation from one "language" to the logic. Written discussion loses the most in this translation. However, no discussion is possible without a common language.
(12 Nov 2020, 21:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]So to me femininity is a feeling and its something you have to experience yourself through your own perspective. Nothing I say with these words will make you finally once and for all "get" femininity on a conceptional level, because it will always fall short of the feeling.
Again, fully agree with each word! But did you notice, that in this thread I asked not about the femininity as a philosophical concept:
(12 Nov 2020, 20:59 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ]What is a stereotypical girly girl in your opinion?
That's different, don't you think?
Well you did ask me join the thread on femininity which I respectfully decline because of my above statement and personally its just an uncomfortable topic to discuss for me.
But as for the stereotypical girly girl well I think you know: Belle Delphine or similar internet personalities. But I am not heavily drawn to embody such extremely feminine characters, rather ideally I am fine with being like an Instagram influencer like Charly Jordan. She is my favorite person i follow on Instagram and i always get mixed feeling of envy/attraction whenever I go through her posts. But if I had a choice I would definitely switch places with her in a heartbeat 😊
(12 Nov 2020, 22:21 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]But as for the stereotypical girly girl well I think you know: Belle Delphine or similar internet personalities.
Errrrrmmmmm.... So, you are saying that the following are attributes of stereotypical girly girl?
- Posting naked images in very provocative poses?
- Posting a video of her spinning the fidgeting propeller inserted into her ass?
- Selling the water left after her bathing as a drink water?
- Selling computer water coolers filled with the bath water?
I stop here 😁
(12 Nov 2020, 22:21 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Charly Jordan. She is my favorite person
Never heard of her - some nice photos there. Beautiful face and beautiful body!
But still... These are highly tuned photos, meticulously taken and chosen. I've read around and I would call it "stereotypical magazine photos of a glamour super-model", who is actively busy with the content, self-promotion, career, and quite aggressively, I should say. Do you think it's the same as "a stereotypical girly girl"?
(12 Nov 2020, 23:18 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ] (12 Nov 2020, 22:21 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]But as for the stereotypical girly girl well I think you know: Belle Delphine or similar internet personalities.
Errrrrmmmmm.... So, you are saying that the following are attributes of stereotypical girly girl?
- Posting naked images in very provocative poses?
- Posting a video of her spinning the fidgeting propeller inserted into her ass?
- Selling the water left after her bathing as a drink water?
- Selling computer water coolers filled with the bath water?
I stop here 😁
(12 Nov 2020, 22:21 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Charly Jordan. She is my favorite person
Never heard of her - some nice photos there. Beautiful face and beautiful body!
But still... These are highly tuned photos, meticulously taken and chosen. I've read around and I would call it "stereotypical magazine photos of a glamour super-model", who is actively busy with the content, self-promotion, career, and quite aggressively, I should say. Do you think it's the same as "a stereotypical girly girl"?
-Lol no! I meant her style and feminine appearance.
-Actually she has posts w/o makeup or editing and she looks fine/the same to me. And tbh women look better irl than online. To me you seem to have the impression that women are inherently ugly w/o enhancements? I don't agree because I see many beautiful "ordinary" women on a daily basis in public. And like I said they look better than those glossy supermodels in magazines. (And therein lies my problem because I can train myself to think pictures of women are unattractive over pictures of guys, but irl my eyes always unconsciously drift only to women 😣😔)
(Also can I ask how you quote certain things I say, because the "quote" button doesn't seem to work...)
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]-Lol no! I meant her style and feminine appearance.
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Actually she has posts w/o makeup or editing
You are not talking about Belle, are you?
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]And tbh women look better irl than in those magazines.
It's always in the definition of "better", right? What is "better" for you?
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]To me you seem to have the impression that women are inherently ugly w/o enhancements?
Where did I say that? I did say "not real", though. They represent an ideal non-existent glamour world and glamour image, which cannot be reached even by themselves.
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]I have see many beautiful "ordinary" women on a daily basis in public. And like I said they look better than those glossy supermodels in magazines.
Again, totally agree. However, you said:
(12 Nov 2020, 20:31 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Well they are not tomboys for sure! Just not the stereotypical girly girl.
So, my question was about that "stereotypical girly girl", and you show me photos of
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]glossy supermodels in magazines
(12 Nov 2020, 23:57 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ] (12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]-Lol no! I meant her style and feminine appearance.
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Actually she has posts w/o makeup or editing
You are not talking about Belle, are you?
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]And tbh women look better irl than in those magazines.
It's always in the definition of "better", right? What is "better" for you?
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]To me you seem to have the impression that women are inherently ugly w/o enhancements?
Where did I say that? I did say "not real", though. They represent an ideal non-existent glamour world and glamour image, which cannot be reached even by themselves.
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]I have see many beautiful "ordinary" women on a daily basis in public. And like I said they look better than those glossy supermodels in magazines.
Again, totally agree. However, you said:
(12 Nov 2020, 20:31 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Well they are not tomboys for sure! Just not the stereotypical girly girl.
So, my question was about that "stereotypical girly girl", and you show me photos of
(12 Nov 2020, 23:26 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]glossy supermodels in magazines
-First, I was referring to Charly in the second comment (about w/o makeup), but I was absolutely referring to Belle in the first comment about style and feminine appearance.
-Second, I know its your style of argumentation but you seem to heavily draw on things I said in the past as if to point out inconsistencies. Just know that they are not inconsistencies but rather an occasional poor selection of words/statements/terms. I apologize for that because english is not always my strong suit in school. But you are very intelligent and I think you can extrapolate what I meant 😉
-Third, to me there is no difference between the beauty of women in magazines and irl. Its only that in pictures they sometimes look artificial and that's what makes them less attractive then real women. But besides that, all of my "ideal" perceptions of the female form can be found in real life. No need for digital enhancements. Remember i am an athlete and I see alot of (in my eye) "perfect" women all the time on campus.
-And going back to Charly, her current boyfriend actually admitted that he had a long term crush on her and thought her posts where amazing, until he met her irl and was taken aback about how much more beautiful she actually is in person!
(12 Nov 2020, 23:39 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ] (12 Nov 2020, 23:23 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ] (12 Nov 2020, 23:19 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:3 times more permanent, than 0?
What do you mean by this?
If the hypnosis does not work (as you said), how do you make it more permanent? 😉
(12 Nov 2020, 23:19 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:If someone says words "spirit", "ritual", "voodoo", "daemon" does it automatically make this person a powerful shaman?
No, but in the Kei thread you mentioned that Kei is in contact with some beings and is gifted with these abilities
I never said that. It was a quote from 8chan and I disputed that claim. But you said, that I shouldn't say, that it does not work (or that it's a bullshit) for I might upset the creator 😁
Oh no, I mean it works excellently, except that it wears off after sometime and then my attraction to women reemerges first emotionally then physically. So i'm wondering if there is a more permanent solution or maybe I am not doing trance properly 🤔 😁
I don't mean to interject in an amazing conversation, but I think the attraction to women is just your mind running on auto-pilot....If you truly want the attraction to disappear perhaps it a
eady has...Ask yourself this question to see if there is any attraction to females left...Can you picture having intercourse with them or having oral sex with her...I was happily married(or so i thought) but the actual intercourse only happened 4 or 5 times in 19 years....other sexual times it was all oral, or she spooned me and reached around...I started hypnos 4 years ago and it made me realize that I wasn't attracted to women for sex anymore
Now that we have split up, I cannot picture having heterosexual sex with me as the man at all. I still catch myself looking at open cleavage, but ultimately there is no sexual attraction just jealousy...and I started HRT at 56 last month and living on my own...still have to portray male at work but at home i am free as i need to be
hope this helps
Also, why remove that about you? Wouldn't that help you with an ideal image that wish to attain during transition?
(13 Nov 2020, 00:26 )Sierra13 Wrote: [ -> ]I don't mean to interject in an amazing conversation, but I think the attraction to women is just your mind running on auto-pilot....If you truly want the attraction to disappear perhaps it aeady has...Ask yourself this question to see if there is any attraction to females left...Can you picture having intercourse with them or having oral sex with her...I was happily married(or so i thought) but the actual intercourse only happened 4 or 5 times in 19 years....other sexual times it was all oral, or she spooned me and reached around...I started hypnos 4 years ago and it made me realize that I wasn't attracted to women for sex anymore
Now that we have split up, I cannot picture having heterosexual sex with me as the man at all. I still catch myself looking at open cleavage, but ultimately there is no sexual attraction just jealousy...and I started HRT at 56 last month and living on my own...still have to portray male at work but at home i am free as i need to be
hope this helps
Thank you for joining the conversation Sierra!
To respond to your question, I can only picture having sex with guys but only if I was a female. If I had a choice (because I think I am trans) to switch back to being a straight male and have sex with women or magically push a button and only be a heterosexual woman for the rest of my life, i would choose the latter. When I am watching porn or hypnos I cannot imagine myself as having sex with females only oral and intercourse with guys (but only if I was her). I have no interest in gay sex. Although I think I have no interest in sex with women, I do still find them attractive/"sexy" (whatever that means). I am easily drawn to anything feminine. Like everytime I refresh the forum home page there are those provocative Aliexpress ads of attractive women in sexy outfits. And my eyes are drawn to those images while my brain recognizes that as "hot". But again I would much rather be her, live her life and wear her clothes. Essentially my perspective towards women is a mixture of attraction followed by strong envy of her femininity. I think if I were to be intimate with her, I think it would be very awkward as I would feel like a lesbian.
Also I am curious if HRT has had any noticeable effect on your orientation or sexuality?
Here is an example of one of those ads that I bookmarked:
latex swimsuit
So would do you guys think/feel when you see this image?
For me its attraction to her femininity ->male hormone mind tries to generate lust -> trans identity feels that's wrong and immediately corrects that by generating a strong counter feeling of admiration/envy ->lust disappears ->only thing that remains is deep sadness that she embodies everything that I wish to be/have ->close image.