Just some more, because I think it relates to my situation in regards to orientation:
“Imagine you’re in a female body and you identify on the masculine spectrum. You don’t want to be sexual with men, because those men would treat you as a female-bodied person, and that kind of sexual interaction is not of interest to you. So even if you did have attractions for men, you might not engage with men or even indulge in fantasies about men until you can be witnessed as and interacted with in your affirmed gender. Having a body that matches your gender identity and that you feel comfortable in allows you to expand the genders that you feel comfortable interacting with.
Dulcinea Pitagora [
DulcineaPitagora.com], a queer psychotherapist and sex therapist who specializes in working with gender and sexual minorities, describes other ways physical changes can lead to sexual expansion. “Some clients who are masculinizing or feminizing through hormone replacement therapy and experience changes in skin texture and body hair might become attracted to or fascinated by their own bodies, sometimes by virtue of feeling sexier in their own body, and look for that in new partners in a way they hadn’t before. For others, they may want more of a contrast in others’ bodies in order to more fully appreciate the changes in their own body, and look for someone that expresses gender much differently than they do....
[The point above is actually another reason why I use erotic hypnosis (since I can't use HRT yet) because my deeper attraction to men somehow compliments or affirms my femininity. Its really hard to explain but that's just how I feel]
....It remains unclear to what extent these shifts represent brand new attractions that never existed before versus attractions that a
eady existed to some extent but were suppressed or dismissed. Some trans people report clear pre-transition desires to one or the other gender that they actively suppressed, in many cases because they were trying to fit in with the heterosexual norm given their gender assigned at birth. As one trans woman explained in an older
1998 study: “I couldn’t be attracted to a guy when I was a guy because that would make me gay.” Others remember only fleeting attractions that were not very strong until their social and/or physical transition allowed them to enjoy and embrace these more challenging feelings. And some don’t acknowledge any pre-transition attractions toward the “new” gender."
I think these points really hit home on why I feel I would be a heterosexual woman post transition. It just seem more "natural" to me than the natural attraction I have right now but as the wrong gender/sex.
(10 Nov 2020, 18:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]It just seem more "natural" to me than the natural attraction I have right now but as the wrong gender/sex.
(10 Nov 2020, 17:33 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ]you are trying to screw even more things up and complicate you situation even further
A month ago my wife read me a story from the KillMePlease forum. I don't remember the details... A boy, who thought that he is born in a wrong body, and who is fully transitioned and who was trying to find a male partner to match "his/er/whatever identity", suddenly found a loving and accepting girl, with whom he deeply fell in love. It turned out, that all he actually needed was love and acceptance, and all these jumps through the hoops were not needed. But now he has a ruined body and can't have children anymore. And they want kids... and to be a normal family...
(10 Nov 2020, 18:43 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ] (10 Nov 2020, 18:23 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]It just seem more "natural" to me than the natural attraction I have right now but as the wrong gender/sex.
(10 Nov 2020, 17:33 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ]you are trying to screw even more things up and complicate you situation even further
A month ago my wife read me a story from the KillMePlease forum. I don't remember the details... A boy, who thought that he is born in a wrong body, and who is fully transitioned and who was trying to find a male partner to match "his/er/whatever identity", suddenly found a loving and accepting girl, with whom he deeply fell in love. It turned out, that all he actually needed was love and acceptance, and all these jumps through the hoops were not needed. But now he has a ruined body and can't have children anymore. And they want kids... and to be a normal family...
Did they detransition back to the male gender? Maybe like you said he needed love and acceptance but was actually fine with being a guy all along. Personally, i do not feel fine in my current body and living the rest of my life as a male regardless of whether or not I find a partner is an unbearable thought. That's why its so difficult to discuss gender and orientation at the same time, because it make people think its an sexuality problem all along, and if you fix that then you fix the gender issue too.
But who knows, i'm still a virgin who has never had any relationship or intimate contact with either men or women. All I know for now though is I have a gender issue and my sexuality has simply aligned with that issue.
(10 Nov 2020, 18:56 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Did they detransition back to the male gender?
Not possible anymore...
(10 Nov 2020, 18:56 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]But who knows, i'm still a virgin who has never had any relationship or intimate contact with either men or women.
Now we are finally getting to "the source"...
(10 Nov 2020, 18:56 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]All I know for now though is I have a gender issue and my sexuality has simply aligned with that issue.
Sex (a set of physical characteristics) ≠ Gender (non-physical mental feature)
None of the above defines the Sexual Orientation. Scientifically proved.
Sex is a constant, permanent feature given at birth, sorry (unless you achieve the level above the 3D-space-time limitations)
The rest can change.
Society is toxic. Political correctness is toxic. Social expectations are toxic.
Sexuality is important, but much less important, than actual (natural, not forced) relationships.
Healthy relationships imply mutual acceptance.
(10 Nov 2020, 19:31 )Like Ra Wrote: [ -> ] (10 Nov 2020, 18:56 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Did they detransition back to the male gender?
Not possible anymore...
(10 Nov 2020, 18:56 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]But who knows, i'm still a virgin who has never had any relationship or intimate contact with either men or women.
Now we are finally getting to "the source"...
(10 Nov 2020, 18:56 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]All I know for now though is I have a gender issue and my sexuality has simply aligned with that issue.
Sex (a set of physical characteristics) ≠ Gender (non-physical mental feature)
None of the above defines the Sexual Orientation. Scientifically proved.
Sex is a constant, permanent feature given at birth, sorry (unless you achieve the level above the 3D-space-time limitations)
The rest can change.
Society is toxic. Political correctness is toxic. Social expectations are toxic.
Sexuality is important, but much less important, than actual (natural, not forced) relationships.
Healthy relationships imply mutual acceptance.
I don't think this is about relationships. I am just stating facts about where I am currently in life. Just because I never had a relationship with a woman, doesn't mean my trans feelings will magically disappear once I do. Its actually the opposite. The more closer i get with women, the greater my dysphoria gets. I have had many female friends/colleagues before in sports, at school and work and while most guys would want to get to know them as more than friends, I actually envied them. Everything from their bodies to gender expression etc...This mental perception has existed within me way before i started erotic hypnosis. I think the hypnos just brought it to the surface.
Like I said, i'm fine with being single (indefinitely if that's whats meant to be) but as long as I don't remain in my current sex/gender(male) (I combine sex+gender because i a
eady mentally perceive myself as female but my body doesn't align).
Also, no one (including society or political correctness) is forcing me to become trans. Its just the way I have felt inside for a very long time since the start of puberty.
I probably have late-onset gender dysphoria:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_dys...d_symptoms
(10 Nov 2020, 17:46 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]I have read that other trans women had a similar issue and one of the many things that HRT did was lower their sex drive to women or completely switch it towards men. Not all of them went through such a complete change, as some trans women remained attracted to women.
I did HRT for a little more than 6 months and that was around 14 years ago. By the time I started it, I had a
eady had several relationships with males and females so was fairly well open to the idea of being with any gender. During my time on hormones, it did seem like my focus had shifted slightly towards hetero-normative behaviors (me as female being with a guy) but I can't discount the people I was around for playing a part in steering me in that direction as well. I can sort of remember the hormones making me feel more emotional and vulnerable and looking to male identifying people as support and protectors. My roommate, whom is also MtF, was also undergoing HRT and she swears that transitioning flipped her to total hetero-normative behavior. Years later, she was trying to convince me that if I just continued HRT, like she did, that I wouldn't want to be with any females and I would even stop liking any of the fetishes I have since "they are just outlets for not being in a heteronormative relationship". I think she's completely full of it on that last part but maybe there's something to the rest of it.
(10 Nov 2020, 20:24 )essanym Wrote: [ -> ] (10 Nov 2020, 17:46 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]I have read that other trans women had a similar issue and one of the many things that HRT did was lower their sex drive to women or completely switch it towards men. Not all of them went through such a complete change, as some trans women remained attracted to women.
I did HRT for a little more than 6 months and that was around 14 years ago. By the time I started it, I had aeady had several relationships with males and females so was fairly well open to the idea of being with any gender. During my time on hormones, it did seem like my focus had shifted slightly towards hetero-normative behaviors (me as female being with a guy) but I can't discount the people I was around for playing a part in steering me in that direction as well. I can sort of remember the hormones making me feel more emotional and vulnerable and looking to male identifying people as support and protectors. My roommate, whom is also MtF, was also undergoing HRT and she swears that transitioning flipped her to total hetero-normative behavior. Years later, she was trying to convince me that if I just continued HRT, like she did, that I wouldn't want to be with any females and I would even stop liking any of the fetishes I have since "they are just outlets for not being in a heteronormative relationship". I think she's completely full of it on that last part but maybe there's something to the rest of it.
Yeah I wouldn't call it heteronormative in my case, because I don't feel as i do because of some societal pressure...its hard to explain but for me its more of an spiritual/energetic feeling of compatibility. Like the complimentary nature of yin and yang. In other words the more femininity I embody/ express, the more i am attracted to the masculine principle/energy. But I am only speaking for myself!
(10 Nov 2020, 20:03 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Its just the way I have felt inside for a very long time since the start of puberty.
Saying that your dysphoria started at puberty really stands out to me but I don't want to say that it means one thing or another, only to explore that your dysphoria could be related to another issue. Also, please don't take this as me trying to minimize or invalidate your feelings, It's not a black and white issue, there is much grey area.
For me, I've had my gender dysphoria since probably the age of 4, whenever I realized that boys and girls were dressed differently (no idea of anatomy at the time). All other trans people I know have reported basically the same as me, that they've felt their dysphoria from very early childhood age. You said yours started at puberty? How was your pre-pubescent life then, were you completely at ease playing as boys do or did you notice something about yourself?
(10 Nov 2020, 20:55 )essanym Wrote: [ -> ] (10 Nov 2020, 20:03 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Its just the way I have felt inside for a very long time since the start of puberty.
Saying that your dysphoria started at puberty really stands out to me but I don't want to say that it means one thing or another, only to explore that your dysphoria could be related to another issue. Also, please don't take this as me trying to minimize or invalidate your feelings, It's not a black and white issue, there is much grey area.
For me, I've had my gender dysphoria since probably the age of 4, whenever I realized that boys and girls were dressed differently (no idea of anatomy at the time). All other trans people I know have reported basically the same as me, that they've felt their dysphoria from very early childhood age. You said yours started at puberty? How was your pre-pubescent life then, were you completely at ease playing as boys do or did you notice something about yourself?
Well according to Wikipedia there is the condition of late-onset gender dysphoria...and I have read some people found out they were trans into their late 20s, 30s and beyond.
In reply to your second comment, from what i remember, i had no problem playing with either gender. Though most of my memorable times involved playing pretend with other girls. Sometimes we would act out things like making recipes in the sandbox using nearby flowers and weeds, while other times we would actually play dressup with barbie dolls. But I don't see how stating this will in anyway change how i feel now?
(10 Nov 2020, 20:03 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Just because I never had a relationship with a woman, doesn't mean my trans feelings will magically disappear once I do.
You are absolutely right.
(10 Nov 2020, 20:03 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]I have had many female friends/colleagues before in sports, at school and work and while most guys would want to get to know them as more than friends,
(10 Nov 2020, 17:46 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Right now I have a stronger attraction to women
(10 Nov 2020, 17:29 )Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Even now if i get the slightest attraction to women, I immediately try to turn that into an emotional/friendship kind of admiration rather than anything sexual. If they are really beautiful/"sexy", well I try to conjure up feelings of envy instead of lust as best as i can. .. I guess what i want to say is that I want to be a heterosexual woman if I ever to choose to fully transition.
Do I not see a contradiction here? Why can't you proceed with the relationships, while continuing to envy the girls at the same time? Why can't you combine the pleasures of both? Can't you enjoy the look of a sophisticated cake, it's taste, envy the chef, who has the skills to make it and can wear a funny white hat, telling your girlfriend, that you always wanted to sing the bass in the opera, but you're a countertenor, and feeling the arousal in the anticipation of the continuation.... 😉