Think of bikers (the guys on sport bicycles, I mean) in tight lycra shorts. Bulges are very visible and nobody cares. Because ...
(04 May 2021, 08:56 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: you play the usual "excuse card" by doing cycling or jogging.
Yep. And sweaty joggers or dirty bikers do not usually go shopping, just like others in dirty or stinky clothes. See my point? 😉
(04 May 2021, 08:56 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: - "muffin top' bellies sticking out the top of the waistband
"Bodyshaming"? 😂 Same for guys in one-piece swimsuits. I used to do yoga stuff in sporty pantyhose and waterpolo swimsuit, and my son made a remark about my belly (which was not any close to a beer-belly - I trained 7 days a week that time!).
For me, aesthetics is the king. If we are talking freedom to wear whatever you want, what about the freedom of not seeing what others consider abusing of their aesthetic feelings?
(04 May 2021, 08:56 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: And wow, one aeady called for closing the thread altogether.
Not everybody is willing to question their world interpretation and perception system 😋
Question. Why is public nudity prohibited?
As far as I'm concerned, they are free to wear whatever they want in any way.
I think I simply hit a nerve bursting their bubble. It's like they're mistaking wellmeant advice for personal judgement. it's just a hint kind of thing, nothing more nothing less.
But hey, someday they might indeed have a very unpleasant encounter in public due to them disregarding any sense or care of what might spark public disdain and all I can say then is "Told ya so!"
The dirty sweaty joggers/cyclists might not do actual shopping but especially in urban places, they do often pass through boutique streets and or mall passage ways and think it's totally OK.
Let's not forget that there's more to this sum of joggers & cyclists. A certain percentage of them are not JUST jogger/cyclists, there are fetishists amongst them as well. These are the guys like us who post fetish pics on social media. However, in their usual jogging/cycling routine they might.. they.just might tread into vague gradients between usual sports gear and an aesthetic that is more clearly intended to show off 'assets'. I know it's a tricky thing to pinpoint, but I think you might have a hunch of what I mean.
Freedom is and should be there for everyone I do agree about that - but this freedom also comes with responsibility and a sense of what is accepted in one's place and time. And indeed, the public onlookers also have a freedom of not being confronted by a display of whatever is generally considered to be offensive.
And yes, each country has laws about public display.
Anyway, the basic principle hinges on this threshold where freedom of the individual crosses a line and starts being consisered as active offense to public/general sensibility.
And it seems that some of our fellow Lycra enthusiasts either go around with blinders to this concept or they simply dont care and only care about their individual freedom.
Sure go ahead, as far as I'm concerned. It's your choice. - but dont come back crying like a snowflake when things go wrong.
(05 May 2021, 03:23 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: Freedom is and should be there for everyone
As I always say:"Freedom from what?" 😉 You surely should have freedom from being touched against your will. Freedom from being called names or freedom from being judged is much more difficult to guarantee. What is offensive and what is tolerable is yet another ever changing social agreement. Again, quoting myself (sorry for that 😇):
(15 Apr 2021, 16:18 )Like Ra Wrote: Tolerance or social acceptance is to what extent the society is willing to roleplay along with someone's "mental constructs" (aka "fantasies' or '"imaginations").
"Bodyshaming" or "no bodyshaming" belongs to the same "roleplaying".
(05 May 2021, 08:51 )latexballet Wrote: When you go lycra shopping and find this in a lady's boutique in your local mall. What do you do? Buy just colour one of them or buy all colours? 😁 🤔
I just go in and buy ones that fit me.
When asked, I simply say “ Well, if it fits me, it will sure fit ______ .
But if you don’t want my business, I’ll go else where. “
06 May 2021, 03:35 (This post was last modified: 06 May 2021, 03:40 by MIWSTIUS.)
(06 May 2021, 00:04 )Like Ra Wrote: As I always say:"Freedom from what?" 😉 What is offensive and what is tolerable is yet another ever changing social agreement. .
First and foremost; the "freedom" aspect was brought up by the ones I supposedly offended, judged and curbed at that other forum.
They mistook what is play-it-safe advice for
judging them and imposing restrictions upon their realworld public space exposure.
9 out of 10 times, things might not go wrong if they go about their whatever they're doing out there in whatever manner.
It's moreso advice for that one single time when an increased risk scenario might occur.
The kind of scenario in which it is no longer a matter of what the social and legal construct dictates as generally acceptable; but rather, a heat of the moment scenario when someone feels extra entitled; It's exactly such moments when a clash confrontation is more likely to happen.
The jogger in the park who happens to be a fetishist as well might have felt extra cheeky that day and dressed up accordingly (ergo, risky)...but at the edge of the park there happens to be a hangout group of testosterone brimming frustrated adolescents, who are mentally ready to snap at whatever irks them within their line of sight.
See where this is heading?
(15 Apr 2021, 16:18 )Like Ra Wrote: "Bodyshaming" or "no bodyshaming" belongs to the same "roleplaying".
The other point is moreso about the secondary, lateral effect of social judgement.
Aside from the direct public frowns of silent disdain in public, these days this has a substantial chance to carry over to social media online. So whereas someone wasnt "brave" enough to call out whomever offended his standards of decency, might have gotten a snapshot and heck, maybe even a full identity, ready to shame the "offender" online.
The lateral effect of this over accumulated time, potentially results into online stigmatic memes. Just google MAMILs and the search results will show you an array of this phenomenon.
This is the awareness I intended to raise at the swimsuit forum, but these guys are so caught up in defending their "freedom perimeter" that they fail to see the bigger picture.
06 May 2021, 06:02 (This post was last modified: 06 May 2021, 09:47 by Like Ra.)
(06 May 2021, 03:35 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: It's moreso advice for that one single time when an increased risk scenario might occur.
That reminds me of the movie Die Hard with a Vengeance. Detective John McClane is 'forced' to wear a very dangerous board with racial slur written on it in Harlem...
I feel your frustration, but you can't help others that way. That only leads to dependency. They won't really learn/know why they shouldn't go in public wearing tight swimsuits, so best case scenario they will come back to you every time a decision needs to be made, and you can't possibly solve all of their problems. I'm going to sound super nerdy, but what would happen if Superman really existed? what if he could solve all of our problems? we would only depend on him. Superman is there to remind us that we can be better, we must be better, on our own. If you really want to help them, then be a good example, influence people and let others know that there is a better way of doing things, but let them choose.
Maybe what they are doing is bad for the swimsuit community, we don't know, but I guess they don't fully understand that their actions will have a bigger repercussion than just their own lives. If there is a scandal, then every swimsuit wearer will bear the consequences. Worst case scenario, instead of wearing swimsuits, we will start from zero and create some other kind of swimwear.
I feel that you did your best by sharing your thoughts, but nothing else can be done. Most probably, next time you read something related to the topic in that forum, you won't feel as motivated to engage in conversation. My best advice is to not let it get to you, breath deeply and relax because this is a marathon, it takes years to make changes in peoples minds. Just take a look at this video, all of these changes were controversial back then, and some made their way through and now are considered normal.
06 May 2021, 06:49 (This post was last modified: 06 May 2021, 07:17 by MIWSTIUS.)
(06 May 2021, 06:02 )RedEmeraldKitsune Wrote:
(06 May 2021, 03:35 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: It's moreso advice for that one single time when an increased risk scenario might occur.
That reminds me of the movie Die Hard with a Vengeance. Detective John McClane is 'forced' to wear a very dangerous board with racial slur written on it in Harlem...
https://
Source: youtu.be/t8DJGw3rIwI
I feel your frustration, but you can't help others that way. That only leads to dependency. They won't really learn/know why they shouldn't go in public wearing tight swimsuits, so best case scenario they will come back to you every time a decision needs to be made, and you can't possibly solve all of their problems. I'm going to sound super nerdy, but what would happen if Superman really existed? what if he could solve all of our problems? we would only depend on him. Superman is there to remind us that we can be better, we must be better, on our own. If you really want to help them, then be a good example, influence people and let others know that there is a better way of doing things, but let them choose.
Maybe what they are doing is bad for the swimsuit community, we don't know, but I guess they don't fully understand that their actions will have a bigger repercussion than just their own lives. If there is a scandal, then every swimsuit wearer will bear the consequences. Worst case scenario, instead of wearing swimsuits, we will start from zero and create some other kind of swimwear.
I feel that you did your best by sharing your thoughts, but nothing else can be done. Most probably, next time you read something related to the topic in that forum, you won't feel as motivated to engage in conversation. My best advice is to not let it get to you, breath deeply and relax because this is a marathon, it takes years to make changes in peoples minds. Just take a look at this video, all of these changes were controversial back then, and some made their way through and now are considered normal.
https://
Source: youtu.be/KyJYfn8Q5tU
+1
No worries, I'm not fazed - just a bit astounded at, how out of all people, these guys didn't get the memo.
Because I know they organize swimmeets - They always make sure to check with the swimming pool managements IF they will be allowed or not.
They also make sure the forum posts dont contain flagrant pictures of indecency. So, they know...they should know how to make Lycra wearing in public space (swimming pool) an accepted thing.
Anyway, that specific thread was about wearing leggings in public so I have no worries about them tainting the men-in-swimuit community.
But it seems to me that they might have become complacent in their accepted status at swimming pools, that they automatically assume they can get away with anything on public streets as well ; therein lies the fallacy imo. I tried leading by example; posting my leggings outfits with the bulge concealing long T-shirts, as I showed them here link
They still didnt get it and just continued on to moan about how I supposedly judged, offended and dictate them.
In fact, I remember a guy who was perhaps the very first one to show himself - with his face fully visible and a chubby physique, as a onepiece swimsuit wearing man online during the very early 2000s. He went by the username of "badpak boy" .
Oh dear, did he get roasted.
Whenever I go swimming - sea or pool - I wear a Triathlon suit. This goes down to my knees and variously short sleeve or no sleeves.
Never gets a second glance or any disapproval from lifeguards, staff or public.
It's also great not to have a tight waist as I would have had from trunks with ties.
Also it feels fantastic, will protect more of your body from harmful UV rays and looks very good (IMHO) .
Downsides are if you need the loo mid swim - it's a bit of a struggle to re-don wet tight fitting lycra!
Always meaning to invest in a neoprene tri-suit, just haven't got round to it yet. I used to have an Osprey Shortie wetsuit I bought in Bondi Junction in the eighties - sadly perished now (literally).
(06 May 2021, 06:49 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: just a bit astounded at, how out of all people, these guys didn't get the memo.
Yes it's somewhat disappointing, to see people misunderstand the original idea out of the blue. Like... they were doing things so right, and all of a sudden 'Nope' let's change direction and surprise everybody.
(06 May 2021, 06:49 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: Anyway, that specific thread was about wearing leggings in public so I have no worries about them tainting the men-in-swimuit community.
Oops my bad, I confused garments... it's kind of the same problem, but different at the same time.
(06 May 2021, 06:49 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: But it seems to me that they might have become complacent in their accepted status at swimming pools
Yeah happens all the time, I guess they are stretching their luck, and hopefully they are just figuring out their limitations... hopefully.
(06 May 2021, 06:49 )MIWSTIUS Wrote: They still didnt get it and just continued on to moan about how I supposedly judged, offended and dictate them.
I hate when that happens, they could have asked for more info or a clarification if they didn't get your point, but nooo they actively complained about your warnings. Maybe they do need to get roasted, I mean you tried to help them, but they misunderstood your intentions...
eady called for closing the thread altogether.
