General TG, TS, TV and sex change thread

[Like Ra]

My chromosomes are neither distinctly male nor distinctly female

XY differences of sex development – Atypical androgen production or inadequate androgen response, which can cause incomplete masculinization in XY males. Varies from mild failure of masculinization with undescended testes to complete sex reversal and female phenotype (Androgen insensitivity syndrome)

Syndromes are not called syndromes for nothing. So, let's think in 80% male versus 80% female terms 😊

I don't think, that an 80% male can be converted into an 80% female. SEX-wise!!! Not GENDER-wise! As "gender" is a social category ("something between the ears").

[Like Ra]

Oh, interesting article! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotype_threat

And I knew, that Nordic countries are a bit different!

Some studies have found null results. The single largest experimental test of stereotype threat (N = 2064), conducted on Dutch high school students, found no effect. The authors state, however, that these results are limited to a narrow age-range, experimental procedure and cultural context, and call for further registered reports and replication studies on the topic.

Must confess, I did not read the articles completely, but I will return to them later. (I have a TO READ list 😬).

[davinasissynw]

Rowling's stuff is mostly on Twitter, but she has posted and continues to post a lot about how trans women are not 'real' women

As far as I remember, her statement was absolutely correct. Those, who complain about the statement, confuse "sex" and "gender". It was discussed in details half a thread ago.

And .... "continues"? "A lot"? Really?

Certainly up until a year or so ago when I blocked her Twitter certainly. Based on the way she treats a Trans character in Hogwarts Legacy I'd say she hasn't changed much.

She's also pretty active in the Mumsnet crowd and you REALLY don't want to start reading some of their stuff.

[Like Ra]

a Trans character in Hogwarts Legacy

Errmm... No idea what this is about....

Mumsnet crowd

Same issue... Any links?

[vanessa_fetish]

True, on one hand, all classifications are wrong by nature, because in most cases there is no sharp dividing line between "the neighbours" (any examples of the opposite?). However, even in the MIF world (Male, Intersex, Female), there are certain sets of criteria that make classification IN MOST CASES possible. Typical example, "usually", skeletons can be reliably identified as either M of F. If there is something "atypical", then it's by definition can not be considered as "normal" (in Gauss sense), and can not be easily classified.

Edit:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_determ...on_(human)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_differ...Physiology

we have to STOP thinking the old way.

Is there a "scientifically and medically approved" new way?

(BTW, is "medicine" a science? In the US definition?)
Edit: aha, officially, it's a combination of practices and sciences.

Does it have to be approved that way? And don't forget - science and medicine CHANGE over time. What we thought was once a 100% true fact turns out not to be that way.

And we can blame Euro-centric belief systems on the belief there is only 2 sexes or 2 genders. Ancient civilizations have recognized 3 or more, it was western religion that says there can only be 2. And once we were held in reverence (often the medicine men in native American tribes for instance). And yes, our science still has been influenced by the outdated thoughts on sex and gender and is too slowly moving away.

[vanessa_fetish]

My chromosomes are neither distinctly male nor distinctly female

XY differences of sex development – Atypical androgen production or inadequate androgen response, which can cause incomplete masculinization in XY males. Varies from mild failure of masculinization with undescended testes to complete sex reversal and female phenotype (Androgen insensitivity syndrome)

Syndromes are not called syndromes for nothing. So, let's think in 80% male versus 80% female terms 😊

I don't think, that an 80% male can be converted into an 80% female. SEX-wise!!! Not GENDER-wise! As "gender" is a social category ("something between the ears").

My POINT is that far too many say "well the chromosomes determine". Mine are distinctly neither, ie falls under intersex (I was actually "corrected" at age 2 surgically and given Testosterone shots til age 11).

You think FAR TOO TECHNICAL buddy.

[Like Ra]

Does it have to be approved that way? And don't forget - science and medicine CHANGE over time. What we thought was once a 100% true fact turns out not to be that way.

Absolutely "yes" to both. If at least 80% (80/20 rule) of all cases fits the classification model, it's quite a good model. If 95% (80/20 rule applied twice) - it's an excellent model. Even if the 80/20 principle might be not 100% applicable here, the highest published estimated percentage of the intersex people I saw is 1.7%. So...

And we can blame Euro-centric belief systems on the belief there is only 2 sexes

3. MIF. Intersex officially exists.

You think FAR TOO TECHNICAL buddy.

Yep. I prefer to think technically, logically and formally (what are the other ways?). According to the docos above, it's a combination of characteristics. Chromosomes is one of them.

[davinasissynw]

a Trans character in Hogwarts Legacy

Errmm... No idea what this is about....

Mumsnet crowd

Same issue...  Any links?

Mumsnet is a popular (in the UK) discussion forum for parents - there's some odd stuff on there: https://www.mumsnet.com/

And if you've avoided the stuff about the Hogwarts Legacy game then lucky you 😊 - I won't force links on you, best to avoid it.

[vanessa_fetish]

Does it have to be approved that way? And don't forget - science and medicine CHANGE over time. What we thought was once a 100% true fact turns out not to be that way.

Absolutely "yes" to both. If at least 80% (80/20 rule) of all cases fits the classification model, it's quite a good model. If 95% (80/20 rule applied twice) - it's an excellent model. Even if the 80/20 principle might be not 100% applicable here, the highest published estimated percentage of the intersex people I saw is 1.7%. So...

And we can blame Euro-centric belief systems on the belief there is only 2 sexes

3. MIF. Intersex officially exists.

You think FAR TOO TECHNICAL buddy.

Yep. I prefer to think technically, logically and formally (what are the other ways?). According to the docos above, it's a combination of characteristics. Chromosomes is one of them.

And thus why you won't fully understand trans.

[Like Ra]

a Trans character in Hogwarts Legacy

Errmm... No idea what this is about....

Mumsnet crowd

Same issue...  Any links?

Mumsnet is a popular (in the UK) discussion forum for parents - there's some odd stuff on there: https://www.mumsnet.com/

Yes, I see now. Kinda brutal. https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationshi...of-support, https://www.transwidowsvoices.org, https://childrenoftransitioners.org/2019...its-all-ok ...

On one hand, I do feel for both sides. On another.... I'm happy that my wife is OK with my indulging in my autogynephilia (and she even helps me with some things), as long as I'm not going to transition 😁

But how does JKRowling fit into this? Any links?